Why is the Vibration Training market so Hard to Understand?
This is a question I am being asked constantly now with most people getting very confused as to what to buy, why and from whom. I will quickly explain below the concerns I have and how the confusion surrounding this industry is deliberate and why I am so hard on those selling dodgy machines.
- If a machine is not built to a good standard not only will it not work for long (reports of broken units coming in hard and fast lately), but it may not work at all. Combine that with the injury risks from uncontrolled 3D units or machines running at incorrect Fq. It’s just not worth it.
- Simply creating a “Vibration” is not Vibration Training. If it was that simple then we would have had this science up and running 100 years ago - correct? The only people you will hear say otherwise are the same marketers or manufacturers that would sell you fake Aids drugs.
- If a machine is built to the level of a proper Vibration Training device - then the correct postures needed when in contact with the unit become so important that unsupervised use actually becomes irresponsible (education of the buyer is very important here).
- If the program does not match the unit even the best machine can become an injury trap.
Why is this not told to you….
To some involved in this industry, taking your money is just a game, with the fact they are selling you a health product to be used on your body not even considered. They risk some capital - you risk your spine - and the expanding obesity crisis comes second to their expanding bank accounts.
This is the game they are playing with you and why it looks so confusing from the outside.
In chess you have 3 stages to a game.
(1) Opening
(2) Middle game
(3) End game
Opening…
In the opening players set up their defenses and potential attacks. If a photo of the game around move 10 was shown to most other players they could basically work out whats going on even if they had not witnessed the game up until that point.
Our opening was the “real” industry building good quality units, testing units, doing R&D or opening places to access them safely.
Middle Game…
This is where you will see pieces scattered all around the board in what appears to be a random order. A photo of a middle game would tell an outside player little as to other’s strategies and past movements.
This is YOU the consumer at the moment , looking at a middle game and wondering why it looks so disorganized.
This is where the marketers like to step into the game - making off the confusion and doing their utmost to make out they are a part of the “real” industry, relying on the presumption you will just get tired of hearing conflicting information and flow like water to the nearest/cheapest dealer.
Their mantra of “but at least at this price you aren’t risking much” sounds logical, except for the risk to your future health that is not being discussed.
The dishonest marketers/manufacturers (about 160 out of 180 at last count) have relied on this confusion period to be of 5yrs minimum from the introduction of Vibration Training to your country, so they can make back their investments. They fully understand the risks to you.
My aim is this - to shorten the “Middle Game” buy releasing so much marketing free information to the consumer as to collapse their plan and give them a very expensive lesson at the same time. And yes I am aware how aggressive and condescending this sounds.
The end game is yet to come…
A group of us have made it our relentless endeavor to have a clean industry where the end game has no losers but those who should not have been playing with your health in the first place.
If you are still confused, my advice is to wait for us to finish our work.
In the mean time education is your only weapon. Keep reading, keep asking…
53 Comments
- Di Heap
October 3rd, 2007Part of a current article on Strength Versus Cardio, in sports news journals:
Almost 40 years after Dr. Kenneth Cooper coined the term “aerobics,” a concept that would later spawn a generation of spandex-clad cardio junkies, some trainers are steering their clients away from traditional cardio-intensive workouts and toward mostly strength moves.
The reasons: Many exercises that are good for the heart are hard on the joints. And cardio training without muscle conditioning can lead to loss of muscle and bone density, experts say.
Even Cooper now believes strength training is important. Some people — those fighting aging and those with injuries — benefit from more time on muscle conditioning than cardiovascular exercise, he said in an interview from his Texas clinic…end quote
Cardio and strength training each have a place in a fit lifestyle and WBV is a type of strength Training
To clarify about the above ” confusion marketers ” these include companies that give out information that Pivotal and Lineal units can be directly compared in an attempt to gain a sale, knowing this not to be true.
Note: It would be impossable to be around these units for any length of time and repeat that information without knowing it to be a lie.
If anyone has staff acting like this correct their behaviour immediatly or risk your entire company being labeled as dishonest and shut out of any joint activity the real industry will have in the future.
No “confused” companies will not be invited to the end game.
- MikeyB
October 3rd, 2007Thats a great article Lloyd, But again most are.
Fro what Di posted,
Who on here does cardio aswell as WBV? Do you Lloyd?
I am just wondering as I completely believe in the whole picture but a lot of you seem to really believe that WBV is enough. I should do cardio and am starting back up this summer , the only reason I halted was for an experiment I was doing.
Note: NO EXERCISE IS A ISLAND , Vibration Training does not break that golden rule. I would fire any of my trainers that said otherwise.
- MikeyB
October 3rd, 2007So starting back after 18 months of getting buff with WBV. Its looks like it was worth it
Thats great to hear that your trainers do promote the full package.
“We are not going to beat obesity with a limited imagination.”
- mike Hair
October 4th, 2007I always recomend my customers do cardio and eat healthy if they want to achieve any form of weight loss as WBV is not a quick fix cure I see it more as a long term solution. If you look at people that do resistance training at the gym and don’t eat properly they normally look they same two years down the track.
WBV + cardio + nutrition = great results. - Di Heap
October 4th, 2007Yes Mike
For everyone your formula’s right. I’d tend to add in some other resistance training as well though depending on the WBV machines used but I’m just being pedantic. I started WBV, in January, just because I’d read about it for over a year but I didn’t have a good understanding of what it could do for me. I hoped it would help stabilise my body core and give some relief from glutes pain and referred nerve pain down my leg. It did way more than that! I can now lay/sleep on the side that was constantly painful for 18 months previously and I’ve heard others say the same - that it’s great for core strength and balance. I then found that I was losing some weight. I already did some cardio so the difference, for me, was adding in WBV.
Mikey
I know good quality WBV works: For weightloss, body core stabilisation, strength, overall sense of “good-feeling” and much more but no-one has ever said that it works alone. It’s an excellent start if people are not doing any exercise and in fact it does work alone for weeks or even some months by which time people usually feel fitter and more likely to start some cardio. Hey, walking is cardio and it doesn’t have to be intensive- Not everyone wants to be an athlete. To your question: Do people who work with WBV do any cardio work? Yes, of course they do.
How is your friend doing with his WBV tone-up workouts?
Lloyd
Your article is scary in the part where you say that poor quality units may not give any benefit and worse, that there are injury risks from uncontrolled 3D units and incorrect fq. Thanks for your articles on this forum that help people find good quality machines. I hope it wont be too much longer that people have to ask so many questions before they leap on a machine. Personally I’m lucky to be able to access good quality but if I travel I have the same problems/questions as everyone else so I know the benefit of lots of education.
- MikeyB
October 4th, 2007Di I asked who on here does cardio aswell. Of course others do cardio combined with WBV, I do a combination.
I know walking is cardio, I didnt state that everyone wants to be an athlete! Wha I’m getting at is when promoting overall wellbeing to a client who is 20kgs or more overweight the chances are very slim of them starting cardio and changing their diets without someone on their case or supervising them. As motivation is the main problem.
Now dont say WBV will get them fitter and stronger and then they will start cardio. I know this but only a small amount will and that is because of their motivation.
A 120kg woman who is 40kgs overweight will feel great, sleep better have less pain and be a hell of a lot stronger but the chances of her losing weight are very slim as a 15 min magic workout wont do this without the whole picture especially with what she put in her mouth. Its a shame that the majority of people dont really care about the other benefits until they reach 60 years old.
There isa lot to say about being able to sleep 8 hrs without pain and tossing and turning - MikeyB
October 4th, 2007Oh and my friend his a little road block.
Is starting all over again on Monday
He strained his LCL ligament from getting to eager with his running and doing too much too soon as hes had 3 years off running and been training again for 3 months.But its all cleared up and the physio said it was alway ok to do WBV but he kept favouring one leg so he took 2 1/2 weeks off everything except riding a exercycle and now hes sorted.
Its all because he has a week ass and hammys as a lot of runners do.
Will keep you filled in though.
I will try convince him to get on here, but hes not much of an iternet man. Just emails and banking hahaha - Di Heap
October 4th, 2007Ouch LCL injury is less common than MCL I think. I found that WBV helps but you do have to never ever again do any lunge position on the machines and also be careful that your semi-squat is perfect..ie knees back,never over toes. Who on here does cardio? I do although not so much lately which has put me out of Akld Marathon (had injury then flu) and so does my partner but we did cardio before we started WBV so maybe we don’t count.
I disagree that a 120kg women needs to do cardio and nutrition changes immediately/concurrently with WBV. Weightloss is an interesting topic and how the body loses fat/weight is something I am very interested in. Starting any form of exercise is way more important that dieting and no reduction in food is recommended for around two weeks (in my own personally designed program anyway, and many others agree). Exercise alone starts weight(fat) loss and then reducing/changing food and adding extra exercise gives better and lasting results. I lost near 5kg from WBV alone earlier this year during a time that I was unable to do cardio. I’m not saying just do WBV, okay, But you are wrong..a 120kg women (why not a man!) will start slowly, definitely losing weight with WBV alone to start, as it causes increase in BMR. Those that then do cardio and make the necessary changes to diet can turn their lives around. A big plus for me was perfect blood tests for the first time in 10years. Maybe I am just odd, maybe it was chance, and I wasn’t 120kg anyway but I did have impaired glucose tolerance and high insulin (yes, both) and a few other things..all perfect now and I haven’t changed anything else.
Changing the static populations mental attitude towards exercise is the primary task of Vibration Training. I believe its unbiased approch ( you dont need to be fit , young or light ) to participate is what the fitness industry needs .
It will be used as a stepping stone , allowing people to change their body composition. This in turn changes the image they have of themselves.
Asking this static population to go from 0-100 has not worked in the past , and I see no way for it to work now.
Alternative approches to getting people healthy need to be taken.
- sparkly
October 6th, 2007So for those that do believe in the results of a WBV, which brand/model do you recommend most for home use? I was looking at the Power Plate My3. I am overwhelmed by all the options and of course they all say they are the best. Help anyone?
- sparkly
October 6th, 2007Also, does it matter if the machine only has one frequency of 35hz? Does having multiple frequencies for thousands of dollars more really mean that much? I can’t seem to find any unbiased literature on the importance of frequency and seconds the machine allows you to use it for, etc. For personal home use, this is a lot of money to spend for example on the Power Plate My3 at $2,500 where the next model jumps up to $4,500. For an average home consumer, what do I absolutely need to look for in a WBV machine?
The wide ranging Fq’s offered on a cheaper/lighter unit mean almost nothing on some units I have seen. I operate all my units at 43hz but even that would be pointless if I didnt have the machines built properly.
Read this article , it should help.
http://www.vibrationtraining.net/2007/05/choosing-a-vibration-machine-for-home
- Di Cussen
October 20th, 2007Hi
I have a client who would like to hear from any type 1 or 2 Diabetes who has had results from WBV, maybe we could have an article on how WBV will benefit diabetics in general.Thanks
Looking forward to some great feed back. Hello Di Cussen,
There is a study in title of “Efficency of Vibration Exercise for Glycemic Control in Type 2 Diabetes Patients”.
You may download a copy of the paper from:
http://www.medsci.org/v04p0159.htm
TC
Who came up with these poses ?
http://www.medsci.org/v04/p0159/ijmsv04p0159g01.jpg
Obviously no-one with any experience or understanding of Vibration Training . They only did the poses for 30sec each, on a Physio setting , and only 2 of the poses I would expect any kind of body composition change with.
Hi Lloyd,
Perhaps the vibration training program can be better designed. However, the point is even with this training program, the study has already shown a positive result indicating Vibration Training may help in Type 2 Diabetes patients.
TC
True TC , but it was a weak test for Vibration Training and a waste of resources ( machine and peoples time ) .
The results would need to be more profound if they wanted to get people to take notice. So the lack of thought put into the program I find irresponsable as we will only have so many opportunities to prove our point.
I think they just basically wasted one.
- Michael Horst
October 25th, 2007I am researching vibration training for individuals with bilateral hip replacement and found conflicting information.
Some manufacturers do not recommend the use of their machines by anyone who has had hip replacements while some doctors are using the training for recovery.
Do you have any thoughts or suggestions regarding vibration training and hip replacements?
Only machines with side-rails ( for taking pressure out of the joints during standing poses ) should be used with anything like hip replacements or any equation you want the pressure to be taken out of but still want movement.
Be carefull of large negative response platforms with handles only at the front. In this scenerio only sitting in front of the plate should be allowed.
- MikeyB
October 26th, 2007Lloyd that sopunds like a load of bullshit to me.
Are you saying you want no pressure on the hips because of the replacements.
Im sure after having a hip replacement for 1 yr or more you would hope you could start doing resistance training again.
What would be the point in doing the exercise if you are going to put minimal body weight on he area.
You always seem to say what is correct (by your views and for some reason only yours are correct) and you never explain enough that someone could actually make a decision from your answer.
Are you sure the reason you need side rails aren’t because you have a machine in your studio with side rails?
The only other machines really with side rails are the $200 machines that are crap.
Are specific therapy machines ie Body Pulse not suitible for rehap?
I have units with ( Vibra-Train ) and without rails ( Bullet ) I believe this choice will become standard in the future.
I also think you will find Body-Pulse originally had a zimmer type frame for the units for just that scenerio. They may be fine for physio work I dont know , the reason I do not recommend them to anybody is I have not had good dealings with their company ( dodgy staff ) and had complaints from one of their customers about the quality of their product.
My explaination…
I would be concerned about the effects of hyper-speed + hyper-pressure onto an artifical joint . The joint may be fine , the cement may not. I personally believe you should have the option of taking the pressure out of the movement.
MikeyB…
My reputation is built on my “opinion” which I would hope by now is built on my own reasoning , open communication and work done over the years. Anyone who follows my advice is free to also read others opinions on sites like this.
Note: I am not some shameless salesperson resorting to marketing pitches. Yes , there are some people out there who would put you at risk and sell anything that moves for anyone who will pay , I have met them.
I would rather bow out of the industry than become that pathetic.
For those of you interested…
Polymethylmethacrylate ( PMMA ) is the cement used in approx 60% of all hip replacements , 40% do not need cement. The operation can only usually be re-done twice at most.
I would like to do some research into the effects vibration has on PMMA and alternative methods/cements that will need to be addressed if Vibration Training becomes standard rehab practice.
E-mail me if interested.
- Di Heap
October 26th, 2007Lloyd, Could pivotal machines with those big handlebars that go across the sides be used or are lineal machines preferable?
MikeyB - I’m sure there is another lineal machine that has side handlebars but I can’t remember the brand name.
Personally I’ve found side handlebars amazing. They allow you to take part weight on your arms and upper body and put less stress on your hips, quads, knees (I have some recurring knee problems because I wont give up running/race-walking). Just facing front handlebars and holding them does not adequately take the pressure off my knees when needed. I would want to use a lineal , but if a pivotal was all there was available , it could be used with proper foot placement and settings.
- martiza
October 27th, 2007I think Hypergravity offers handlebars. You could check in their website.
- gabrielle
January 26th, 2008Can you use a WBV machine bought in the US in Europe? I live in the US currently but we might be moving to London soon and if so I want to make sure I can use the machine in both places. Any advice most appreciated.
You will have to ask the manufacturer
- donna
February 11th, 2008I have had a knee replacement and wonder if the machine is o.k. for that. Also what I got out of this blog is linear is the best
If you have a knee replacement you need a unit with a frame or handle bars to take the pressure out of the knee without compromising the angle.
Do not use a standard unit , it may do more harm than good.
To whom it may concern,
I believe it is time for some of the top range companies to start placing statements on their websites that clearly indicate our position on some issues. Apart from being competition most of us stand for a certain quality of product that should in fact put us on the same side.After a period of time these ” common statements” throughout or sites will be re-read by consumers visiting comparisons and certain messages that are positive to all our companies will get through.
Why………. ?
This is to combat certain companies latest stratagy of saying 2D vibration is second rate to 3D vibration. This tactic of course is being used to cover up the poor design of the machines , and other even cheaper manufacturors are now starting to repeat this information.
Proposed statement….
2D vibration = Controlled Vibration ( engineering exellence )
3D Vibration = Uncontrolled Vibration ( sub-grade engineering/materials )That is it , if your company wishes to explain further , they can do so , but that statement should appair intact somewhere on your site. This I believe is in the best overall interest of all companies striving for a better industry.
We do not have to agree on everything , but we should agree on some.
Kind regards Lloyd Shaw
This from an Educational Resource Article for a Physio course…..
Injury to the facet joints or disc may also occur secondary to rotational exercises such as “twists” or the rotatory torso machine. Because of the joint alignment in the low back; there is limited rotation available; therefore joint injury or disc “shearing” may occur.
In english…….
If your feet are on a platform that is vibration in all directions your spine is trying to re-adjust to the movement. This must cause sideways action , this is simple phyics , not an opinion.
Talking of being hard to understand….
I do not understand why I am still getting calls from people who have purchased a dodgy machine off the internet and complain it doesnt work or no information comes with it.
If you are looking online , why would you not spend time researching the product/company you are planning to deal with , I mean you are already on the net so very little effort is required.
If this happened 2 years ago , I would have said it was logical as only a small amount of info was available , it happening now in 2008 I just dont get it ?
I just had a major sports store realize they have been ripped off. When I asked the buyer why they didnt ask around first , all I got was silence.
It is almost as though some people want to be ripped off or injured which I suppose will secure a place for those who offer this service.
“It seems you can lead a horse to water , but you cant make it read”
- Di
February 29th, 2008Reason No.1 Greed - sports store wanting to make easy money.
Reason no.2 Greed - Marketer spinning tales of amazing machine at low cost instead of giving honest information and value related specs ie. low specs, made in china, low price.
Reason No.3 Greed and Stupidity - Buyer thinks he’s getting a great deal for little money and doesn’t bother to compare brands and deals.
Reason No.4 Ignorance - well you can’t do much about that one as some people just don’t seem to learn well and will buy whatever is offered, believing all that the Marketer tells them.. then they complain to the only people who will listen (cause the Marketer wont), people like you, Lloyd. - Wayne Campbell
March 1st, 2008It sounds like the buyer will have an awfull lot of explaining to do to his/her superiors - and looking at ways to cover thier butt.
I assume that its a New Zealand store and that narrows the field quite a bit. They will want to protect thier image. Be interesting to see what they do from here to with the product.
This will be a good test of thier integrity
I am starting to get reports of marketers adding ….
” Made in New Zealand ”
on their websites to sell Asian machines.
Funds raised from the business side of the IVTRB ( launching soon ) will be used to actively punish those responsable.
I would like ideas/votes on appropriate action we should take. Keeping in mind we will not operate under normal corperate guidelines.
All bets are off.
October 3rd, 2007
To those who are working to have a “clean”, safe, effective Industry
Please do keep on educating people while you work on clean-up. Not all can wait or want to wait. The benefits of using quality machines are enormous for those who are obese and want a starting point for weight reduction, for those who have pain from various conditions and can be helped (like I was) and for everyone else from people wanting increased fitness through to athletes. I understand what this article is saying about risks so please keep up lots of education. Thanks