Why People Are Skeptical
It appears a number of cheaper Asian vibration units are now being distributed. The marketing claims are quite impressive — until you actually see the unit.
The Claims
- Weight Loss
- Increse in bone density
- Relieve Pain in Joints
- Over weight Constipation Pain
- Lower Cholesterol
- Respiratory Disorders Arthritis Low Backache
- Better Sleep
- Increase Cardiac Fitness
- Sciatica Stiff joints and muscles Beauty-skin problems
- Insomnia Regulating sugar levels Hypothyroidism
- Frozen shoulder Fatigue Numbness & Many more
The Unit
The Unit in Action
Looks like someone has fallen asleep on the job. This unit is available in large numbers on New Zealand auction site TradeMe for $NZ560
Written by Site Administrator on February 6th, 2007
53 Comments
Yes it does seem high , but only if you dont account for the involuntary fight or flight response. Any Zoologist will tell you about the energy expended during these short bursts of movement.
We had some fitness professional overseas trying to hook up a CO2 emission device to people on a plate ? And wonder why no or low readings where recorded. Which showed me how deep the lack of understanding surrounding involuntary reflexes where.
So we moved away from those statements until better education and tests are place.
Note , head on unit ?
For those who doubt any such calorie burn rate can be achieved in such a short time.
Here is a link to a medical equipment companies website with approx. calorie burn rate attached to their Lineal unit..http://www.smitechasia.com/product.php?selected_product_id=85
Important to note:
This is only a light medical model , not a full workout unit. This company is well respected and supplies hospitals worldwide with BCA and Medical Scanners.Dimensions : 800W x 630D x 1430H (mm)
Weight : Approx. 90kg
Electrical Requirements : AC 230V 50/60HzPower Consumption : 700 Watts
Control Mode : Microprocessor Control
Control Device : AC Motor, Inverter Control
Speed Control : 15Hz to 55Hz
Vibration Type : ?Up-down? Motion
Body Fat Burn Off Rate : Approx. 400 kcal @ 10min WBV Exercise,
15 Hz speed
- Erik
February 7th, 2007Hi Lloyd
Please suggest another measuring-method to prove your 10 minutes 1000 Kcal burning theory.
And, there is quite a difference between 400 and 1000 Kcal.
Note: Speed of unit during tests was at the machines weakest speed ( 15hz ) Our prorams start at 40hz .
There is no precise measuring method for this to date that I know of.
Very similar to the ” long calorie burn ” process of weight training , where like our units you continue to use energy long after your workout has finished.( even Dr. Broadbent agrees with that one ) .
That is why I used terms like ” up to ” myself when mentioning figures. They are only approx. based on my theory’s. Which are what the entire machines are built on.
And at the end of the day. You either trust me or you dont come into my studios. No arm twisting here.
- Peter T
February 7th, 2007Hi Lloyd,
I”m confused. The advert I’ve seen from your company says “Burn 1,000 calories in 10 minutes”. It doesn’t say “Burn up to…”. Surely you have some evidence to back up this claim?
Otherwise this is surely a breach of the fair trading act.
- Erik
February 7th, 2007Lloyd, you´ve mixed up Kilojoules with Kilocalories.
Maybe there is a chance to burn 1000 Kj (238 Kcal) in 10 minutes Vibra-Workout. Even that number would be sensational.Take a look at http://www.healthyeatingclub.com/info/books-phds/books/foodfacts/html/data/data2a.html - mike Hair
February 7th, 2007Incase people are forgetting WBV is not new, it has been researched for the last 20+ years, how come all of a sudden everybody is trying to dispute the many benefits of it. Take a look at Lloyds body, that I’m sure did not happen by chance.
I have been operating a studio for 12 months now and the results my clients have achieved are great. This is simply another form of resistance training that doesn’t require a lot of time.
Instead of looking for a way to criticise something why don’t people give it ago for 3 months and see for them selves.
(A MAN WITH AN EXPERIENCE IS NEVER AT THE MERCY OF A MAN WITH A THEORY) - Sam Lee
February 7th, 2007Mike,
The reason people are taking issue with Lloyd is that he has no evidence to back up his advertising claims yet at the same time is calling respected researchers liars. Lloyds body is not evidence of burning 1,000 calories in 10 minutes. Vibration training has a lot of great benefits but claims like this will bring the entire industry into disrepute.
I recall Jenny Pearce commenting how ludicrous this claim was on the radio last year. Lloyd needs to back up his words with evidence rather than slagging off respected researchers. - mike Hair
February 7th, 2007Sorry Sam i have reread the blog reguarding Lloyds comments about DR.Broadbent and no where does he call her a liar, he simply points out the fact that her comments are not based on research regaurding weight loss, also the whole article was so contradicting of it self you can’t help but laugh at it.
- mike Hair
February 7th, 2007Sam
Regaurding Lloyd having evidence to back up his claims, why don’t you call in and see him I’m sure he can introduce you to some very happy clients, would that not be evidence enough?
A peice of paper with claims on it is one thing, people with results can’t be disputed.
Mike
- Sam Lee
February 7th, 2007Mike,
I’m not questioning that vibration training offers many benefits. I think the technology is very interesting.
However, Dr Broadbents comments are based on research, not hearsay (as Lloyd agreed in his National Radio interview). I simply have an issue with Lloyd holding himself up as an expert whilst he continues to make advertising claims that are patently untrue. Surely you don’t believe that someone can burn 1,000 calories in 10 minutes on a vibration machine?
Sam
- Josh
February 7th, 2007HI LLoyd
Could you please explain the following comment you made earlier in this section
” Any Zoologist will tell you about the energy expended during these short bursts of movement”
Sorry but dont understand how this applies?
Thank you and look forward to your response,
Best regards,
Josh
Vibration training is not ” exercise ” per say.
Eg… You stay still , you relax ?
It induces a response , which is a part of our fight or flight system. That is why approx. %100 of your muscle tissue is recruited as opposed to %30 during regular exercise..
A note to all…
Read carefully
I voluntarily come here to answer questions from those who seek information about Vibration Training/Therapy.
And will continue to do so.
But I will no longer respond to those people who obviously have other agenda’s or repeat questions already answered ( as per Kirk , this forum has an entire section on what you ask..).
I am sorry guy’s but you stick out like sore thumbs even to the less experienced.
It brings the tone of the entire website down. And will no longer be tolerated by myself. If someone else would like to answers them , be my guest.
..
I also apologize for not being able to condense 25 odd yrs of primate zoology interest into a blog.
I am simply not that good.
- Mike Hair
February 7th, 2007After putting approx 1500 people through there paces at my studio in the last 12 months i cant recall anyone asking such technical questions as to the ones asked on this site. Most people just want to know if it hurts and if it works not how the bloody machines are built.
It is therefore pretty obvious that some people have a hidden agenda.
I think it is a fear call that Lloyd only answers genuine questions, life is to short to get bogged down answering the same question over and over. - Sam Lee
February 8th, 2007Mike,
There’s no hidden agenda. Lloyd called the researcher unethical for having no proof (yet there is research backing up her statement). He needs to admit he is wrong and retract his accusation.His weight loss claims sounds very similar to the “Body Enhancer” which ended with them being fined $720,000 by the commerce commission for having no scientific research to back up their weight loss claims. As with vibration training people did lose weight on the “Body Enhancer” but there was no SCIENTIFIC proof.
If Lloyd wants to through stones he needs to be able to back up his words with facts.
See the body enhancer story here
http://www.comcom.govt.nz/MediaCentre/MediaReleases/200607/792000payoutforfalseclaimsaboutbod.aspx
We are not endorsing a weight loss “product”.
We allow people to do a form of resistance training .
This has been proven through many scientific trials to aid in Body-fat% loss.
In the Dr.s own words…
“There’s some evidence it may improve fitness and yield better results than normal resistance training with weights….”
The sellers of the product at the beginning of this blog was invited to test their ” gives the same workout as a studio model ” with a licensed personal trainer as the judge in Auckland.
At first they said yes.
But when I mentioned my smallest unit was 180kg they backed out ?
Shame that would have been insightfull.
Ask the seller a question
So it,s the same as the units used at Vibra-Train. Yes or no ? posted by: lloydshaw (0 ) 2:41 pm, Tue 6 FebSame workout but different design 3:17 pm, Wed 7 Feb
So you will be willing to let a comparison test be done by a licensed personal trainer ? posted by: lloydshaw (0 ) 6:40 pm, Wed 7 Feb
If you want to, you can. Make appointment with us. 7:11 pm, Wed 7 Feb
Anytime at my main studio . You make time and date. My smallest unit is 180kg. So you will need to bring yours to us. We are right next door to Les Mills , so getting a trainer in will be easy. posted by: lloydshaw (0 ) 11:46 pm, Wed 7 Feb
Is it not apparent to anyone else what a complete ego maniac this Lloyd Shaw is? If his business and product is so fantastic, how the hell does he find the time to sit on this forum on a daily basis updating this website with what can only be described as slanderous diahorrea regarding Bodyvibe. As someone earlier in the forum wisely said, it is really up to individuals to make up their own mind. I personally have been training at Bodyvibe for the past 8 weeks with fantastic results so far. The staff are super friendly, flexible and make sure that every session is one on one. They regularly make changes to our program to ensure that we are getting the full benefits from our training. We also get complimentary fitness assessments as often as required to track progress-and the proof is in the pudding as they say. I do have a friend who uses Vibra Train who too has achieved excellent results-but certainly nothing exceptionally superior to the results that I am achieving through Body Vibe. One would have to question some of the feedback in this form that states that after 3 months of training with Bodyvibe they achieved no results. Whether you are at Vibra Train or Bodyvibe you still control the destiny of your results which also includes diet and lifestyle. If you do not make changes to this area as well you can not expect huge results in a short space of time. My partner is a personal trainer himself-and to be honest thought initially that this whole Vibration training thing in general was a load of rubbish-but respected my decision to pursue it and has been surprised by the results I am getting. The point is however, he always stresses that diet in fact is 80% of the battle and unless you are willing to work hard at getting your nutrition right, nothing is going to magically work.
When Michelle (see above) wrote in with some genuine positive feedback on the Powerplate machines, Lloyd’s fantastic comeback was to accuse Michelle of being a Power Plate representative. This mindset seems ridiculous and for Lloyd to even think this way it does make you wonder if he is guilty himself of posting false feedback, or having his own staff pose as disgusted Bodyvibe clients. I do know for a fact that he has posted flyers on the windscreens of vehicles outside Bodyvibe and around Newmarket with huge “WARNINGS” against using the Bodyvibe facility. Again, pretty sad and pathetic and I repeat, if your business is going so well and is so superior to Bodyvibe why on earth would you need to adopt such blatantly vindictive methods of gaining clientele.
One has to applaud the professionalism of Richard Abbott who has quite openly invited people to call him to discuss any concerns that they may have and has chosen not to get involved in the slagging match that Mr Shaw is trying to provoke.
Everyone has their own products, you sell your stuff and they sell theirs. What’s your problem?
Personally, I think everyone have a brain and can think for themselves. They can make their own decision of which they most prefer.
Cheaper machine does not mean its a bad one.
Some seller might just want to make it affordable for us other kiwi to be able to purchase one for our home.
What do you guys think?
- Kel
February 9th, 2007 - sarah ball
February 9th, 2007Kel - I have never heard of bodyvibe and have just checked them out. Let me state I do not agree with the way Lloyd deals with some of the q’s on this forum, but bodyvibe is def one of those co’s he refers to which buy cheap asian imports and market them through hype. One - these systems have not been independently tested, you do not know what harm they will cause. Two - All the research on the bodyvibe site is stolen from researched done on a totally different system (galileo). Also just read the bit about one motor and two motor system. What a load of BS(total unproven scare tactic). How can you believe a statement from a company who sells their product on other peoples research. Please, people just wake up and stop just a buying into the marketing.
Body-Vibe , 8 Alma St. New Market, is now a furniture shop.
The director is being looked for by those he sold units to.
The distributorship was stripped of him some time ago.
My warnings were serious and have proven accurate over time.
Is it so hard for you to believe my intentions where good ?
Note: That warning was from 2004.
I agree 100% with the consumers ability to make choices.
But the lack of education around Vibration Therapy/Training is what these companies feed off. And considering this is a quickly growing health service being adopted by vast numbers , I believe the questions can not be fired hard and fast enough.And I put myself up there as a target by contributing to this forum.
P.S. The voices in my head all agree I am not an ego maniac.
It didnt take me long to look up that little saga. Its all on the net.
Apparently Body-Vibe was at first invited to join Vibra-Train. But was eventally refused a license due to its use of plastic machines and dealings with Powerplate.
Lloyd Shaw did do a flyer drop to warn people. But only after they had been on T.V. claiming to be the owners of Vibra-Train , with a PowerPlate machines ? Legal pepers were served.
Approx 4 studios under Body-Vibes influence have closed to date. Website is gone.
And the company has shut down. Check out former directors.- Mike Hair
February 10th, 2007The name on the company register for bodyvibes is KYLE JACK-MIDGLEY, who i think has skipped the country?
So Kel it looks like Lloyd is not an ego maniac with verbal diahorrea after all, Just trying to warn the public.
Keep up the good fight Lloyd - Wayne Campbell
February 10th, 2007Kel or who ever you really are, goodness knows why you are dragging this up again.
Last year I imported Vibro-Gyms into New Zealand. Through this I had dealings with a Body Vibe director. I found him to be, by deeds and words, a liar, untrustworthy, and downright unethical.
I was warned about this person before I had dealings with him, however I take people at face value. The warnings rang true.
This person lied to my face, tried to steal my website by ringing the company who set it up and telling them that they now owned it.
No wonder they are no longer in business.
I no longer import Vibro-Gyms into New Zealand and will post more about that shortly
- Wayne Campbell
February 10th, 2007Mike, he is the director I am talking about in my previous post
- Sam Lee
February 10th, 2007Speaking of studios shutting down - I notice several of the Vibra Train studios have changed names to Vibra Gym. Why’s that?
This is old news , but I will explain anyway. It may help people understand the dynamics of the industry’s past.
The ex-directors of Body-Vibe promised all Vibra-Train studios ( 10 at the time ) money from sales and other advantages if they swapped labels.
One of their main points was the public would only ever get on a well tested European model.
I had stated all along to Power-Plate and Vibro-Gym that the job had not been finished. And the units needed to be upgraded for full commercial operations to be future proofed.Wayne Cambell and Vibra-Train was the importer of the Vibro-Gym at the time , but for fluctuating quality issues we had decided to discontinue it’s importation.
I was not happy with this decision myself but found it necessary to protect my studio owners.
Body-Vibe quickly swapped from Power-Plate supporters to Vibro-Gym importers.
Even Power-Plate found this unethical.They also convinced these studios I could NEVER produce a decent machine. As I simply wasnt that smart.
In other word I was defrauding everybody by making promises I could never keep.
4 studios voted to leave , 6 voted to stay.
I felt let down with their lack of faith and vision , but picked myself up and carried on.Our label now have 20 studios. We have 5 full commercial units available to our owners , built here in N.Z.
3 studios under Body-Vibes influence have closed.
Important to note…
Kevin Barclay-Webb of Vibro-Gym U.K. subsequently worked hard to fix the quality control problem with the Vibro-Gyms.
- Wayne Campbell
February 10th, 2007Sam,
I was at at the meeting that Lloyd is talking about where 6 of the 10 studios put our trust and faith in Lloyd Shaw and Vibra-Trains future as a leader in this industry.
You have only mentioned part of the story, not suprising I guess as your sole motivation appears to be to discredit Lloyd and Vibra-Train
The other part of the story you have ommitted, and it is unfortunate to see any business close for any reason, however two of those VibraGym studios you mention have since closed. And since then Vibra-Train has grown to 20 studios with more planned.
We started with one studio and due to increased demand in our area where there are comppeting studios we now have two, Hawkes Bay have grown to two and Hamilton now have 3 studios.
Lloyd Shaw and Vibra-Train are obviously doing a lot of things right - according to the public that support us, and that support is growing.
I think it is a Freudian slip that this question about wayward studios was asked on a blog called
” Why People Are Skeptical ”
When you lay out what we have had to go through in a chronological order it’s amazing we have any faith in anyone.
Maybe I should write a book…
” We where so poor I had to carry my horse to school , and it was up hill both ways……”
What an eye opener this site is. The best material I have ever seen.
I will admit I did come into your main studio with my partner to suss you out. You were busy but I saw and heard enough to be left speechless.
Do you always move that quickly ?
Everything I read on here seems to point in one direction. Lloyd is releasing the only new material around. I have seen nothing from Powerplate or Vibro-Gym for years. And even then it was only repeat celebrity endorsements or old tests. Not on the same level I have seen here.
Where did you learn this Lloyd ?
Are you taking this to the U.S. ?Yes we are entering the U.S. market. Just moving at a nice solid pace.
February 6th, 2007
Hi Lloyd,
I seem to remember that you claimed on your website that you could burn a 1000 calories in 10 minutes doing vibration training?
this seems to good to be true?
regards,
Peter T